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MECHANICALS With a 30 year-old automobile, there will always be discussion here - maintenance, modifications and mechanicals.

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  #121  
Old 18th July 2014, 04:51 PM
PvD PvD is offline
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

Quote:
Originally Posted by Styria View Post
If you remove the plug, you may as well clean the brass filter. As I said, they give very little trouble, but you should replace the 'O' ring basically as a matter of normal maintenance. Mind you, if the car gave no trouble, or gives no trouble since you replaced the Air Cells, perhaps it is best to let sleeping dogs lie.

Will check for you as far as the Speedo is concerned. I am sure that you would know, but a 450 Speedometer, whilst it will obviously work, will not give you a correct speed reading. Regards Styria
Styria, I'am a great believer in don't fix what isn't broken, so I will fix if and when it looks like a problem. It is nice to know where it is if I need to attend to this, thank again for your help .
Regards,
Peter
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  #122  
Old 9th August 2014, 05:15 PM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

I'am almost there having stripped out the spheres and struts, replacing the front strut ball joints, installing the struts with new flexible hoses, installing the new spheres all with new copper washers, cleaning the reservoir and filling with hydraulic fluid and running the engine the fun started. The battery was dead and could not be revived so used jumper leads to start engine.
One of the high pressure lines to front left sphere was not tight resulting a big puddle of hydraulic oil. Fix this try again, slight leek back rear.
Raised car and secured drain line connection. All going well now except for dead battery.
Upon further investigation the alternator was not putting out what it should. Removed alternator to be tested by auto electrician (who are a special bread as I will explain later). Tested on test rig worked fine. Bought new battery from auto electrician, need to support local when you reside west of the Hawkesbury.
Home again put it in the car again no output, take it out again back to auto electrician and he would investigate alternator internally. A couple of day later rang auto electrician and he advised the alternator was fine and further investigation would require the car. Home again fitted the alternator, but no charge light on before starting engine, back down to auto electrician in the car with new battery fine alternator.
At the auto electrician it was resolved that there was a break in the cabling between the alternator and the charge indicator light and a Friday afternoon too big task to take on. Took car home, followed wire from alternator to under battery where the new sphere was fitted, big gap in cabling found. Fixed cable and charge light works and alternator is charging. As an electrical engineer if find it difficult to understand why the indicator light failure would stop the alternator from charging. The reason upon further investigation is that the prowler through the light energises the field winding until the alternator is charging. This is why I consider auto electrics strange if the cheer lamp fails the alternator may not commence charging but there is no indication that this is occurring since the lamp that is supposed to show the fault has failed. The moral is check you charge indicator light illuminated after you turn the ignition on but before the engine starts.
Now the only remaining issue is the front did not appear to rise and fall when I used the high/normal control. Checking in the engine bay the connecting rod between the front level control and torsion bar has disappeared. I am sourcing a new connecting rod but am mystified how I SET THE HIEGHT OF THE CAR. My service manual does not have section 40-315 can any body HELP.
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  #123  
Old 13th June 2017, 12:21 PM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

Just to add some more to this thread.... Note the expected lifespan of the cells (3 years or 120,000km max). Any more than that and you're doing well.

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01 Ford AU 5L (Deep Blue)
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87 420L#324309-P
87 420L#-P
88 420L Euro#-P
88 420L#-P
86 560L#235896-P
79 6.9#5541 (Red Bull)
78 6.9#4248 (Skye)
79 6.9#3686 (Moby Dick)
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  #124  
Old 28th June 2018, 10:32 PM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

Try these guys for rechargable cells... They did the work on Man O War back in 1996!

https://www.jonlinhydraulics.com.au/
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Mark

01 Ford AU 5L (Deep Blue)
89 560L#322020
88 500L#451660-P
88 420L#422477-P
87 420L#324309-P
87 420L#-P
88 420L Euro#-P
88 420L#-P
86 560L#235896-P
79 6.9#5541 (Red Bull)
78 6.9#4248 (Skye)
79 6.9#3686 (Moby Dick)
78 6.9#1776 (Dora)
77 450L#067010-P
75 450L#028414 (Gold Nugget)-P
57 Buick 73A (Titanic)
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  #125  
Old 8th August 2018, 05:15 PM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

OK here I am answering my own questions again!

6.9

Front and central 3 x 75 Bar RED dot cells (PN 126 320 0715),
Rear 2 x 60 Bar BLUE dot cells (presumably superseded to GREEN dot cells PN 126 320 0115).

W126

Front and rear 4 x 57 Bar GREEN dot cells (PN 126 320 0115),
Central 1 x 75 Bar RED dot cell (PN 126 320 0715).
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Mark

01 Ford AU 5L (Deep Blue)
89 560L#322020
88 500L#451660-P
88 420L#422477-P
87 420L#324309-P
87 420L#-P
88 420L Euro#-P
88 420L#-P
86 560L#235896-P
79 6.9#5541 (Red Bull)
78 6.9#4248 (Skye)
79 6.9#3686 (Moby Dick)
78 6.9#1776 (Dora)
77 450L#067010-P
75 450L#028414 (Gold Nugget)-P
57 Buick 73A (Titanic)
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  #126  
Old 8th August 2018, 11:25 PM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

The availability of cells is the single biggest threat to the 6.9s existence.... Local supplies have dried up with the usual suppliers moving focus to newer models & the parts people at MB dealers have no idea what you’re talking about if you just supply a VIN!

The only solution is privately importing from OS using DG Freight, or modifying cells with diaphragms intact, or using rebuildable ones from Citroen.
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Mark

01 Ford AU 5L (Deep Blue)
89 560L#322020
88 500L#451660-P
88 420L#422477-P
87 420L#324309-P
87 420L#-P
88 420L Euro#-P
88 420L#-P
86 560L#235896-P
79 6.9#5541 (Red Bull)
78 6.9#4248 (Skye)
79 6.9#3686 (Moby Dick)
78 6.9#1776 (Dora)
77 450L#067010-P
75 450L#028414 (Gold Nugget)-P
57 Buick 73A (Titanic)

Last edited by Oversize; 9th August 2018 at 08:40 AM.
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  #127  
Old 9th August 2018, 09:48 AM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

https://www.dgair.com.au/
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Mark

01 Ford AU 5L (Deep Blue)
89 560L#322020
88 500L#451660-P
88 420L#422477-P
87 420L#324309-P
87 420L#-P
88 420L Euro#-P
88 420L#-P
86 560L#235896-P
79 6.9#5541 (Red Bull)
78 6.9#4248 (Skye)
79 6.9#3686 (Moby Dick)
78 6.9#1776 (Dora)
77 450L#067010-P
75 450L#028414 (Gold Nugget)-P
57 Buick 73A (Titanic)
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  #128  
Old 9th August 2018, 09:49 AM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

I’ve ordered cells through this guy so cross fingers they work...

http://dwautos.com.au/
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Mark

01 Ford AU 5L (Deep Blue)
89 560L#322020
88 500L#451660-P
88 420L#422477-P
87 420L#324309-P
87 420L#-P
88 420L Euro#-P
88 420L#-P
86 560L#235896-P
79 6.9#5541 (Red Bull)
78 6.9#4248 (Skye)
79 6.9#3686 (Moby Dick)
78 6.9#1776 (Dora)
77 450L#067010-P
75 450L#028414 (Gold Nugget)-P
57 Buick 73A (Titanic)
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  #129  
Old 12th August 2018, 06:44 PM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

New rear connecting rod fitted to levelling valve block and torsion bar. Car rose up! Now to purchase promised spheres.
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450SEL6.9 - #4811 Classic White/Parchment velours, AUS delivered 1978
450SLC - Citrus Green/Parchment leather, AUS delivered 1979
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  #130  
Old 17th August 2018, 06:45 PM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

Great news!

Thought update: if MB determined cell life of 2-3 years based on 20,000 km pa average, how long will they last on a Sunday only car (5,000 km pa)?? Surely not 20000/5000 = 4 x 3 years = 12 years???
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Mark

01 Ford AU 5L (Deep Blue)
89 560L#322020
88 500L#451660-P
88 420L#422477-P
87 420L#324309-P
87 420L#-P
88 420L Euro#-P
88 420L#-P
86 560L#235896-P
79 6.9#5541 (Red Bull)
78 6.9#4248 (Skye)
79 6.9#3686 (Moby Dick)
78 6.9#1776 (Dora)
77 450L#067010-P
75 450L#028414 (Gold Nugget)-P
57 Buick 73A (Titanic)
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  #131  
Old 17th August 2018, 07:00 PM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

Being that rubber is the critical component, and rubber tyres have a life around 5 years before they go off (hard) maybe that sounds about right? Then again, tyres are exposed to UV radiation and are regularly re-inflated. However nitrogen in the gas cells have bigger molecules than those of air, so maybe that offsets the re-inflation issue?

Without a base line test using pressure gauges, we’re only guessing here.
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Mark

01 Ford AU 5L (Deep Blue)
89 560L#322020
88 500L#451660-P
88 420L#422477-P
87 420L#324309-P
87 420L#-P
88 420L Euro#-P
88 420L#-P
86 560L#235896-P
79 6.9#5541 (Red Bull)
78 6.9#4248 (Skye)
79 6.9#3686 (Moby Dick)
78 6.9#1776 (Dora)
77 450L#067010-P
75 450L#028414 (Gold Nugget)-P
57 Buick 73A (Titanic)
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  #132  
Old 17th August 2018, 08:53 PM
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Default Re: Sphere longevity

The rubber membranes in the rebuildable Citroen cells can last a lot longer than that. What hastens it’s demise is running with low pressure and not having them regassed. You’ll always have a tiny bit of leakage thru the rubber even if in otherwise good condition. The rebuildable ones can be 15-20 years if checked for pressure every 2-3 years.
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