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MERCEDES W116 Discussion specific to the W116 model

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  #1  
Old 3rd January 2009, 03:03 PM
B13 B13 is offline
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Default W116 and W123 same front seats?

Today I was fixing the seat runners on my 6.9, which had seized...

When I pulled out the drivers seat I noticed underneath it carried a 123 part number, and a manufacture date of 11/12/78, which is consistent with my car being an early 1979 model (#5440) and the general poor condition of the seat / seized state of the seat runners.

The part number for my drivers side seat was 123 910 0350

So I guess the question is that if W116 and W123 use the same front seats, that makes a good source of much younger, lower milage seats if we can pull them from W123s, which were sold up until 1985...

Anyway, back to the job at hand... I'm currently stranded until I get the new seat installed into the car and only 1/2 way through fixing the seat runners.

I.
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  #2  
Old 3rd January 2009, 03:10 PM
GreaseMonkey
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

That could be useful.
Of course earlier, '72 to '76 would not have 123 parts as the 123 started in '76, so I don't think my '80 model 123 parts car will supply me with a runner for my '75 116 driver's seat which is clunky, but I will have a look when I get time.
Certainly the early 116 seats don't look like any 123 seats I have had, but let us know how you get on.
Chris M.
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  #3  
Old 3rd January 2009, 03:51 PM
John S John S is offline
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

The 126 & 123 Seat bottoms are interchangeable, but I did not realise that the 116 matched the 126 but it seems logical. All you would need to do is swap the covers so everything still matched as per the original.
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Old 3rd January 2009, 06:52 PM
GreaseMonkey
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

Wow!
Thanks, I have a few seat base needs and this might help a lot.
Chris M.
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  #5  
Old 3rd January 2009, 08:33 PM
B13 B13 is offline
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

Wow - finally got it all sorted - so here's the story...

I've never been really happy with the drivers seat and rear seat in my 6.9

The rear seat had a rip in the leather, but the drivers seat had a rip in he bolster about elbow height, and on the base the leather was worn, and some springs were stuffed. Also the fore-and-aft movement was very ordinary, and the height (up and down) adjustment was just plain seized.

Luckily whitey, my 450SE race car had the same bamboo interior and with the recent fitment of fixed-back race seats to it, the rear seat was easily replaced from the one in whitey but the front seat provided more of a challenge.

The descision was made that the passenger side seat from whitey had much less wear on the base than the drivers seat, but the back was obviously the wrong orientation (seat angle knob on the wrong side) and besides that it had a centre arm rest attached to it. So I used the base of the passenger side bolted to the back of the drivers side. This solved the ripped leather / worn base leather / broken springs issue.

The mesh map (?) holder behind the seat was cactus so I need to removed the board with the good mesh map holder from the old 6.9 seat and installed it on the replacement seat.

Next to the seat runners, so on Friday I went to Pick-a-Part and bought the best drivers seat runner assembly I could find for $24. It was a bit stiff and not rusted at all, but the black adjuster handles were broken off.

On the seat runner assembly for the drivers side, there are 2 sets of runners, the upper runners control fore-and-aft movement, and the lower runners control the up-and-down set height. On my car the upper runners were stiff but not corroded, needed just to be removed, lubricated and they freed up and were considered servicable. The lower runners had some rust on them, and could only be moved by a hammer while mounted in a vice. The lower runners on the unit picked up from the wreckers were a bit stiff but had no rust and were easy to free-up with lubricant.

I noticed the lower two spring-clips which retain the seat to the floor of the car were rusty so I took the opportunity to replace them as well.

Seat back in and everything now works as it should, I can sit a bit higher in the car now, and the seat which has no busted springs feels rather more competent at supports my not unsubstantial weight (90kg).

If anyone has any questions about the seat runners I'm more than happy to try to answer. They are a complicated beast, but as long as you're methodical they are easy to pull-apart and reassemble, requiring no special tools.

I.
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  #6  
Old 3rd January 2009, 08:56 PM
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Michel Michel is offline
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

Phewwww....

I'm breathless reading through...

Well done...

I can read between the lines how happy you are with the better seating arrangement.
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1978 W116 690SEL # 3312
1985 R107 500SL AMG
2000 W208 CLK430 Coupe
2003 W163 ML320
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Old 4th January 2009, 04:39 AM
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

Hi B13, it took me a bit as well to sift through your post, but to re-cap in a nut shell, I take it that all you have done is to swap the passenger seat base and used it on the driver's side. Correct ? Obviously, if you have the parts, that sort of swap is fairly straight forward although, as you said, quite time consuming, especially if you pull the runners apart and detach them from the seat base.

I guess, (am I wrong ?) that we are still none the wiser regarding interchangeability between 123 and 116 seats. So, does someone know the facts in that regard ?

As far as the back seat in "Whitey" is concerned, was that leather or MB Tex ? I would have said MB Tex, but stand to be corrected.

Also, another point to remember is the fact that only on 6.9 passenger seats is there provision for height adjustment. The other models are straight fore and aft adjustments. Regards Styria
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Old 4th January 2009, 06:04 AM
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Styria View Post
I guess, (am I wrong ?) that we are still none the wiser regarding interchangeability between 123 and 116 seats. So, does someone know the facts in that regard ?
I would say they are for early cars anyway, I used to have my 1977 230 and the seat was stuffed, broken springs, the back part would wobbled around when you put your foot on the breakes etc...
Went to the wreckers here and picked up another seat, same colour from a W116 280, for $30, the bloke even fitted it for me for another $20!

He just unbolted it and swapped it over, with lots of swearing and curseing at the rusty floor bolts

I don't know what year the W116 was, but it had miles on the speedometer.
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  #9  
Old 4th January 2009, 01:11 PM
B13 B13 is offline
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

Probably I should have started a new thread since once the seat was back together to my satisfaction and ready to install back in my 6.9 I sorta lost interest in the W123/W116 compatability.

To sum up, I pulled this from the 6.9:

1978 Driver's seat comprising:

Seat Base: 123 910 0350
Seat Back: 123 910 0216
(leather)
6.9 runner assy with seized height runners, but good handles

I put in:

Seat base (passenger side)(part number unknown) from 1975 450SE
Seat back (drivers side)(part number unknown) from 1975 450SE
(unconfirmed whether leather or MBTex, but they look the same)
Rear map mesh net thingy from my 6.9 seat
Seat runner assy from my 6.9 with the exception of:
Height runners from a 1977 450SE wrecked car

-----

As to the question as to whether the seat runner assy from a W123 would work, I can't say - don't have access to a wrecking W123 at the moment, but will check next time I see one. I suspect not though.

Six M6 screws hold the seat runner assy to the seat base. It would appear that both the W116 and W123 have the holes in the same place, that is two rows of 3 holes 180mm apart, and across from each other by 485mm.

Any MB seat (W116, W123, W126) with that hole layout in the base should be able to be fitted, using the W116 seat runner assy, so a W116.

I.
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Last edited by B13; 4th January 2009 at 01:26 PM.
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  #10  
Old 4th January 2009, 05:57 PM
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Styria Styria is offline
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

Hi B13, thanks heaps for that further information. It'd still be interesting if 116s and 123s would be interchangeable. Another facet to consider is the material - were there any 123s upholsterd in leather. I suspect not, but stand to be corrected. Regards Styria
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Old 4th January 2009, 06:17 PM
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Styria View Post
Hi B13, thanks heaps for that further information. It'd still be interesting if 116s and 123s would be interchangeable. Another facet to consider is the material - were there any 123s upholsterd in leather. I suspect not, but stand to be corrected. Regards Styria


MB Tex for Australian cars, or velour / MB tex for other nations. Or SA cars had a combination of both which I think is really nice
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  #12  
Old 13th March 2009, 11:25 AM
fat stig
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Default Re: W116 and W123 same front seats?

I recently replaced the collapsed drivers side seat base from my '79 280SEL with the base from a passenger side W123 seat. I had no problems. I was concerned that the passanger side and drivers side bases may have been different (because of the height adjustment) but they are identical.
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